Does this sound like spyware?

[Mike S.]

A few weeks ago a relative was having a problem with their computer -
it was extremely slow. I ran several different spyware, rootkit and
virus scans using different programs. I ran them in normal and safe
mode and all results showed that the computer was clean. HijackThis
showed that a file that was a trojan, so I removed it. I also removed
all programs that were associated with spyware.

The slowness problem still persisted so I thought maybe it wasn't a
spyware problem. The CPU usage was at 4% and System Idle Process was
at 99. Everything looked normal, there were no odd processes running,
the hard disk and memory tested ok.

The relative took the computer in to be repaired and the tech said it
was full of spyware and viruses and reformatted it.


How is it possible that I ran several different spyware and virus
scans (using reputable programs) and nothing showed up? And the tech
claims he found spyware? Does it sound like he was lying?

If he was lying then I'd like to find out. I'd hate for my relatives
to take their computer someplace where the employees are dishonest. It
looks like the computer was reformatted but I'm thinking that maybe he
couldn't figure out the problem and decided to just reformat it and
then blame spyware.

I'd really like to hear opinions on this matter.

[Peter van der Goes]

"Mike S." <littleboyblu87@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1179727948.471935.270060@z24g2000prd.googlegr oups.com...
>A few weeks ago a relative was having a problem with their computer -
> it was extremely slow. I ran several different spyware, rootkit and
> virus scans using different programs. I ran them in normal and safe
> mode and all results showed that the computer was clean. HijackThis
> showed that a file that was a trojan, so I removed it. I also removed
> all programs that were associated with spyware.
>
> The slowness problem still persisted so I thought maybe it wasn't a
> spyware problem. The CPU usage was at 4% and System Idle Process was
> at 99. Everything looked normal, there were no odd processes running,
> the hard disk and memory tested ok.
>
> The relative took the computer in to be repaired and the tech said it
> was full of spyware and viruses and reformatted it.
>
>
> How is it possible that I ran several different spyware and virus
> scans (using reputable programs) and nothing showed up? And the tech
> claims he found spyware? Does it sound like he was lying?
>
> If he was lying then I'd like to find out. I'd hate for my relatives
> to take their computer someplace where the employees are dishonest. It
> looks like the computer was reformatted but I'm thinking that maybe he
> couldn't figure out the problem and decided to just reformat it and
> then blame spyware.
>
> I'd really like to hear opinions on this matter.
>
It's a matter of simple economics.
When you worked on the computer, how many hours did you spend diagnosing,
testing, etc.?
For a business, it's not feasible to spend that kind of time on a problem,
then attempt to charge the customer for the time spent.
If a business did that ("We diagnosed the problem and repaired it. That will
be $400 for 10 hours labor."), the typical customer would be outraged and
tell everybody who would listen what a rip-off the XYZ Computer Repair is.
If XYZ gave the customer an up front estimate of $400, how many computers
would be left for repair? Alternatively, formatting the hard drive, then
reinstalling the OS takes an hour? "Your computer is infested with malware.
It will cost you $75 to have your drive cleaned and your OS reinstalled."
It's not that he couldn't figure it out, it's that it's not economically
feasible for the shop to spend the time. The reformat approach also
minimizes the probability that something gets left unfixed, causing the
unhappy customer to reappear demanding the job be redone gratis.

[Lil' Abner]

"Mike S." <littleboyblu87@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:1179727948.471935.270060@z24g2000prd.googlegr oups.com:

> A few weeks ago a relative was having a problem with their computer -
> it was extremely slow. I ran several different spyware, rootkit and
> virus scans using different programs. I ran them in normal and safe
> mode and all results showed that the computer was clean. HijackThis
> showed that a file that was a trojan, so I removed it. I also removed
> all programs that were associated with spyware.
>
> The slowness problem still persisted so I thought maybe it wasn't a
> spyware problem. The CPU usage was at 4% and System Idle Process was
> at 99. Everything looked normal, there were no odd processes running,
> the hard disk and memory tested ok.
>
> The relative took the computer in to be repaired and the tech said it
> was full of spyware and viruses and reformatted it.
>
>
> How is it possible that I ran several different spyware and virus
> scans (using reputable programs) and nothing showed up? And the tech
> claims he found spyware? Does it sound like he was lying?
>
> If he was lying then I'd like to find out. I'd hate for my relatives
> to take their computer someplace where the employees are dishonest. It
> looks like the computer was reformatted but I'm thinking that maybe he
> couldn't figure out the problem and decided to just reformat it and
> then blame spyware.
>
> I'd really like to hear opinions on this matter.

I've had computers come in that are slow as mollasses. Some of them are
infested with spyware, some are not. The ones that are, I'll attempt to
clean up. I've found that even after spending hours getting rid of
everything, the computer still runs slow. So anymore, I'll just call the
customer, tell them the fastest and surest way to get it back to normal
is to reformat and reinstall. In such cases, I always clone their hard
drive, so any data they had is retrievable. Like Peter said, it just
isn't economical to spend hours trying to clean it up, and then still
have a half crippled system.
But unlike the tech you mentioned, I won't tell them it's full of spyware
if it's not. I just tell them that *something* is crippling it and the
surest and fastest way to fix it is to wipe it out and start over. Most
customers go along with it unless they don't have the installation CD or
there's not a restore partition.

One thing I've had happen three times now is that a customer will bring
one in that the antivirus subscription has expired on plus it is "slow".
I've uninstalled the antivirus and it miracuously regained its speed. In
all three cases there was little or no spyware. And on all three I turned
around and installed the free edition of Avast. And Avast slowed it down
very little.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to tell where people go and what they
do on their computer to mess it up. And you have to fortify it
accordingly. I have one customer that bought a new Dell in 2003 and he
has brought it back to me three times to wipe out and reinstall. It
always leaves here with one user and comes back with 5 :-)

--
--- A dyslexic man walks into a bra ---

[Gerald309]

On May 21, 2:12 am, "Mike S." <littleboybl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> A few weeks ago a relative was having a problem with their computer -
> it was extremely slow. I ran several different spyware, rootkit and
> virus scans using different programs. I ran them in normal and safe
> mode and all results showed that the computer was clean. HijackThis
> showed that a file that was a trojan, so I removed it. I also removed
> all programs that were associated with spyware.
>
> The slowness problem still persisted so I thought maybe it wasn't a
> spyware problem. The CPU usage was at 4% and System Idle Process was
> at 99. Everything looked normal, there were no odd processes running,
> the hard disk and memory tested ok.
>
> The relative took the computer in to be repaired and the tech said it
> was full of spyware and viruses and reformatted it.
>
> How is it possible that I ran several different spyware and virus
> scans (using reputable programs) and nothing showed up? And the tech
> claims he found spyware? Does it sound like he was lying?
>
> If he was lying then I'd like to find out. I'd hate for my relatives
> to take their computer someplace where the employees are dishonest. It
> looks like the computer was reformatted but I'm thinking that maybe he
> couldn't figure out the problem and decided to just reformat it and
> then blame spyware.
>
> I'd really like to hear opinions on this matter.

==========================/
Next time use the following for "reputible antispyware" which will
detect virtually all infection:

Free scans...
http://www.bluecollarpc.org/_mgxroot/page_10730.html

Webroot Spy Audit (Top Recommended) http://www.webroot.com/services/spyaudit_03.htm

Trend Micro AntiSpyware Scan Free Scan http://www.trendmicro.com/spyware-scan/

Both Trrend Micro Antispyware and Webroot Spysweeper have consistently
been rated in the top three with CounterSpy for years now. I use both
intermittedly. (One protects the other). I personally as an Advanced
User tested the top ten trialwares and quite frankly the two of these
tied for finding the most positives. Both found four times as much as
the next few products down. After that, it rose dramatically to ten
times as much. I painstakingly searched my computer for every
infection reported by each product and found that after the first four
products the rest did present false positives - and shows to go that
the best security softwares are known for virtually no false
positives. In several years use, I believe there has been only one
questionable item in both Webroot and Trend Micro. They are the best
in the industry with superior real time protection with active shields
blocking installations before they occur. I have found perhaps 2 or 3
infections by full scans in 3 or 4 years now. Sure beats the the first
results of finding over 30 infections before ever installing
antispyware protection.

The point I am trying to make is this..... in real world, there are no
other products that actually detect and protect the machine in
antispyware. Ask anyone who knows.

As far as getting your money back - I am sure it would involve
forensics to see what exactly was supposed to be detected by the
repair shop.

And this is my other point and one reason for replying. For the life
of me I do not know why people go to Computer Repair Shops to get
spyware removed. The software (Webroot) is only 30 dollars. I am
guessing the Repair Shop charged over 150 dollars at least ? Did you
know they may simply run "reputible" antispyware for you and charge
that much ? I mean the Roman Puke Pit is long gone and what plutocracy
is developing in this world - meaning like the rich life, the life of
Rielly, that people simply drop their computers off to get their disks
wiped and Windows reinstalled every time they think they are
infected ?

I mean I know this is not what you have done obviously - but when you
see this time and again it is just very, very queer for lack of a
better term. (real oxford dictionary meaning of queer). Isn't this
like "killing the patient to cure the disease" ? It most certainly is.
You have obviously been ripped off.

There are only two places infections can be:
Windows Explorer
Windows Registry

Get there:
Right Click > Start > Explore (Windows Explorer, all files)
Click > Start > Run > type in "regedit" and Okay/Go (Opens Windows
Registry)

ADVICE: Next time - look under the hood.... may save you hundreds.
MORE: Get paid antispyware activating real time protection heurisitics
that protect the same way antivirus does in real time. Free protection
does NOT protect your machine against infection with the only
exception being Windows Defender free from Microsoft that has active
shields and real time protection ( so so).

I must say as an experienced Advanced User - you were definately
ripped off. Like malpractice suits for bad legal advice, then along
these lines if it were a "reputible" Computer Repair Shop they would
have told you everything I just did and sent you home to get Webroot
and charged you nothing at all - and heck they may even sell Webroot
on CD in their shop for everyone coming in with "infections".

Computer Repair Shops are in business for electronics diagnostics only
- to replace defective internal electronic components - NOT spyware
and virus removal. If you have been told different - you have been
lied to.

webmaster: www.BlueCollarPC.Org / .Net

[Gerald309]

On May 21, 2:12 am, "Mike S." <littleboybl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> A few weeks ago a relative was having a problem with their computer -
> it was extremely slow. I ran several different spyware, rootkit and
> virus >>>>>>>>>CUT>>>>>>>>>>>>
SOURCE:
http://www.bluecollarpc.net/about.html
Here is your alternative to infestation when the PC bogs to a crawl -
or generally called the 512M RAM Upgrade before Vista machines:

"Your Computer slows down to a crawl ....

Computer completely slows down, bogged down, multi-tasking becomes
impossible:

If there are not errors going on from operator error or faulty
software freeze ups and so on, this can be a sign generally of two
things. One, would be of course infestation of adware and spyware
which will do this. The computer can slow down to a crawl - and there
may be constant crashes and unexpected reboots caused by severe
spywares that are actually transmitting your personal data back to the
cyber criminlals or others and committing reboots and flushes and
erasure of their tracks. SMTP outgoing mailers may have been installed
that transmit data out to them. For sake of rule out process, you
either use free scans to determine if your computer is infected with
these - or actually install and use a known and trusted antispyware
program to quarantine and delete them. If this does not clear things
up significantly and almost instantly - then it is indeed time most
likely for a RAM Memory Upgrade neccessary for further operation of
the machine safely and efficiently.

If you have downloaded a lot of programs and have a lot of start up
processes running you may need a RAM Memory Upgrade to be able to run
things as normal again, or as expected. This would generally apply
only if you have installed a lot of softwares and programs. The
standard upgrade has been, in the Windows XP years, sometimes called
the 512M RAM Upgrade. This means your RAM installed from the factory
was probably at 256M RAM of processor Random Access Memory. This is
kind of a cache of memory that start up programs are in to make things
faster - like antivirus, antispyware, firewall, other programs
installed like media and other applications that start up and run when
you start your computer. This is farily simple, and can be done at
home by ordering the correct upgrade - little electronic stick that
snaps into the empty row inside the computer. To do it takes looking
up your exact Model and what the limit is for the upgrade. The
standard has been most Windows XP PCs were released with 256M RAM and
the maximum size is 512M RAM. So the upgrade would be an additional
256M RAM memory stick thus making the new total 512M RAM. You can buy
lower like a 128M RAM stick to add that would make your mazximum then
384M RAM. You would want to have the maximum size of 512M RAM
obviously for fastest and safest operation, Safe so that running
software does not fail. Software programs can become corrupted and
useless when encountering low RAM. Most times you are going to get the
Windows warning that your virtual memory is too low and Windows needs
to adjust. You can temporarily adjust the maximum memory that Windows
"borrows" in the settings:

Click > Start (lower left) > Run (on the menu) > Control Panel >
System > Advanced > Performance > Settings > click Adjust for Best
Performance (note will revert to Classic graphics and click Okay to
save settings) > click Advanced (same place) > Virtual Memory click
Change > on C-Disk only you can set the maximum size available by
clicking Custom ..... you can also click Reset to set things back to
normal. Note with a RAM Memory Upgrade these limits will increase
here.

You can view your current RAM installed by clicking Start > Control
Panel > System

Note that the new PCs with Vista are like a whopping 1G (gigiabits) of
RAM or more. This is best if you run broadband and download a lot of
media and audio files - and the more RAM Memory you have installed
generally allows the most multi-tasking.

Some Helpful Links:

How to Add Memory FAQ
for Personal Computers
http://www.cyberwalker.net/faqs/how-...rade-faqs.html

Microsoft - Add more memory to your computer
If your computer seems slow, now's the time for additional RAM
http://www.microsoft.com/athome/moredone/addmemory.mspx

Ultimate Memory Guide
http://www.kingston.com/tools/umg/default.asp
Kingston has written the definitive document related to memory and the
technology behind it. Everything you ever wanted to know about memory
can be found here.

What is Computer Memory? RAM vs Hard Drive
http://www.weeno.com/art/0699/87.html
"END"
webmaster www.BlueCollarPC.Net / .Org

[Gerald309]

On May 21, 2:12 am, "Mike S." <littleboybl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> A few weeks ago a relative was having a problem with their computer -
> it was extremely slow. I ran several different spyware, rootkit and
> virus scans using different programs. I ran them in normal and safe
> mode and all results showed that the computer was clean. HijackThis
> showed that a file that was a trojan, so I removed it. I also removed
> all programs that were associated with spyware.
>
> The slowness problem still persisted so I thought maybe it wasn't a
> spyware problem. The CPU usage was at 4% and System Idle Process was
> at 99. Everything looked normal, there were no odd processes running,
> the hard disk and memory tested ok.
>
> The relative took the computer in to be repaired and the tech said it
> was full of spyware and viruses and reformatted it.
>
> How is it possible that I ran several different spyware and virus
> scans (using reputable programs) and nothing showed up? And the tech
> claims he found spyware? Does it sound like he was lying?
>
> If he was lying then I'd like to find out. I'd hate for my relatives
> to take their computer someplace where the employees are dishonest. It
> looks like the computer was reformatted but I'm thinking that maybe he
> couldn't figure out the problem and decided to just reformat it and
> then blame spyware.
>
> I'd really like to hear opinions on this matter.

PS ....FINAL REMINDER.... You have got to REALLY trust your Local
Repairman if the family members want to keep dropping off the PC in
today's world. It is STRONGLY recommended that you get a simple 1 or 2
gig USB Memory stick for like 20 or 30 dollars and upload all personal
files OFF the computer BEFORE dropping it off to a stranger. Not
software programs - but stuff like My Documents photos and personal
files and so on. They even come on pendants for the girls and
keychains for the guys piunk and blue. WHEN you get the PC back, you
just download everything back onto the machine and erase the stick.
You NEVER know who is going to start looking at all your bank
statements and passwords at any shop aanywhere.... I mean they already
ripped you off for a bench charge (like about 75 to a 100 dollars just
to plop the pc on their work bench without even touching it yet). Who
knows what was next ?

Think about it !

[Heather]

DAMN, GERALD.......you send SIX posts (5 of them not trimmed) to make
this point?? Fix whatever it is you are using for an ng reader.....

Oh......and I deliberately top-posted because (as Laura would say) I
CAN.....grin.

Now...back to business.

Heather

"Gerald309" <gerald309@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1179944606.736116.27430@q69g2000hsb.googlegro ups.com...

> PS ....FINAL REMINDER.... You have got to REALLY trust your Local
> Repairman if the family members want to keep dropping off the PC in
> today's world. It is STRONGLY recommended that you get a simple 1 or 2
> gig USB Memory stick for like 20 or 30 dollars and upload all personal
> files OFF the computer BEFORE dropping it off to a stranger. Not
> software programs - but stuff like My Documents photos and personal
> files and so on. They even come on pendants for the girls and
> keychains for the guys piunk and blue. WHEN you get the PC back, you
> just download everything back onto the machine and erase the stick.
> You NEVER know who is going to start looking at all your bank
> statements and passwords at any shop aanywhere.... I mean they already
> ripped you off for a bench charge (like about 75 to a 100 dollars just
> to plop the pc on their work bench without even touching it yet). Who
> knows what was next ?
>
> Think about it !
>

[Gerald309]

On May 23, 3:58 pm, "Heather" <nos...@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> DAMN, GERALD.......you send SIX posts (5 of them not trimmed) to make
> this point?? Fix whatever it is you are using for an ng reader.....
>
> Oh......and I deliberately top-posted because (as Laura would say) I
> CAN.....grin.
>
> Now...back to business.
>
> Heather
>
> "Gerald309" <gerald...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1179944606.736116.27430@q69g2000hsb.googlegro ups.com...

================================/
I don;t own Google Groups so there was nothing I could do about that.
The error message was "cannot post your message right now try
later"... so I did. After the 5th or 6th error message - the
confirmation of message posted appeared. So like why did you presume
to FLAME me ???? You too... OK !!!

And what is this crap you wrote???

""QUOTE""

and I deliberately top-posted because (as Laura would say) I
> CAN.....grin.
>
""UNQUOTE""

Apparently you are IMPERSONATING official Microsoft Personel
PRETENDING to be some Microsoft News Owner. Are you personal friends
with Bill Gates you mean ? You see, Microsoft is obviously in legal
conjunction with Google Groups or I could not be typing this right now
at Google Groups. You might be telling everyone in the Microsoft News
Room that you ""and I deliberately top-posted because I
CAN.....grin."" to appear as some 'Group Moderator' - which you are
not - but you see you are now cross-posting into Google Groups whether
you know it or not and over here it is against Terms Of Service to
impersonate List Owners, Group Owners, Postmasters and so on - any
official communication owner title of which I have a few myself like
"Webmaster" and "List Owner" and "Postmaster" and so on, all stemming
from original major domo parameters dating back to the inception of
Usenet which this group on the Google groups side is identified as.

My point is that if you had any respect for that, having less respect
for me, you would not have FLAMED me. It is written - "When you assume
something, you make an ass of u and me (ass u me)"... get it ? I
believe you saw an oppurtunity
to make a personal attack on me - but we all see that your ruse was
flawed, as was Google Groups for the moment that caused this. You to -
big mouth.... (because I CAN !!!!)

me.

[David H. Lipman]

From: "Gerald309" <gerald309@gmail.com>



< snip >

| Apparently you are IMPERSONATING official Microsoft Personel
| PRETENDING to be some Microsoft News Owner. Are you personal friends
| with Bill Gates you mean ? You see, Microsoft is obviously in legal
| conjunction with Google Groups or I could not be typing this right now
| at Google Groups. You might be telling everyone in the Microsoft News
| Room that you ""and I deliberately top-posted because I
| CAN.....grin."" to appear as some 'Group Moderator' - which you are
| not - but you see you are now cross-posting into Google Groups whether
| you know it or not and over here it is against Terms Of Service to
| impersonate List Owners, Group Owners, Postmasters and so on - any
| official communication owner title of which I have a few myself like
| "Webmaster" and "List Owner" and "Postmaster" and so on, all stemming
| from original major domo parameters dating back to the inception of
| Usenet which this group on the Google groups side is identified as.

| My point is that if you had any respect for that, having less respect
| for me, you would not have FLAMED me. It is written - "When you assume
| something, you make an ass of u and me (ass u me)"... get it ? I
| believe you saw an oppurtunity
| to make a personal attack on me - but we all see that your ruse was
| flawed, as was Google Groups for the moment that caused this. You to -
| big mouth.... (because I CAN !!!!)

| me.


Take it easy ! Figgs didn't flame you.

Figgs commented on several non-snipped replies. She is NOT on the MS News Server and she
impersonanting nobody.
She was also being sarcastic. Blame Google on the repetative posts and please... lighten
up.


--
Dave
http://www.claymania.com/removal-trojan-adware.html
http://www.ik-cs.com/got-a-virus.htm

[Heather]

"David H. Lipman" <DLipman~nospam~@Verizon.Net> wrote in message
news:qOe5i.11993$xV.112@trnddc05...
> From: "Gerald309" <gerald309@gmail.com>
>
>
>
> < snip >
>
> | Apparently you are IMPERSONATING official Microsoft Personel
> | PRETENDING to be some Microsoft News Owner. Are you personal friends
> with Bill Gates you mean ? Room that you ""and I deliberately
> top-posted because I CAN.....grin."" <<<<

> Take it easy ! Figgs didn't flame you.
>
> Figgs commented on several non-snipped replies. She is NOT on the MS
> News Server and she impersonanting nobody.
> She was also being sarcastic. Blame Google on the repetative posts
> and please... lighten up.

Thanks Dave.....obviously this humour-challenged person doesn't know
Laura Fredericks and that she often does things and says "because I
CAN". It was just a joke......one he didn't get. Sigh.....

My sarcasm was not necessarily (or just) directed at the repetition, but
at the fact he didn't trim 5 of them and one had to wade thru 6 kb of
nothingness to get to his reply. In this case, top posting would have
been preferable.

Still giggling over him thinking I was *impersonating Microsoft
personnel*........poor man doesn't know me well, that is for sure.

Gerald.....I have NO interest in being an MS MVP nor have I ever
impersonated one. Bill and I get along just fine the way it is. (VBG)

Heather......a free agent.


>
>
> --
> Dave
> http://www.claymania.com/removal-trojan-adware.html
> http://www.ik-cs.com/got-a-virus.htm
>
>