Re: What's so special about a single word?

[SeaNymph]

"Aardvark" <Aardvark@youllnever.know> wrote in message
news:1cs7a6wkq4fr7.xst5lwuocfjc.dlg@40tude.net...
> On Thu, 7 Oct 2010 20:16:38 -0400, FromTheRafters wrote:
>
>> "Dustin" <bughunter.dustin@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:Xns9E0ACE2ADDC9BHHI2948AJD832@no...
>>> "FromTheRafters" <erratic@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in
>>> news:i8ln32$egq$1@news.eternal-september.org:
>>>
>>>> "~BD~" <~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
>>>> news:yPednYdgGaVQpDPRnZ2dnUVZ8hidnZ2d@bt.com...
>>>>
>>>> If you want to add a crosspost, do it yourself - please do not
>>>> attempt to make it look like *I* added it.
>>>>
>>>> I resent your use of "Followup-to:" to make me look like a troll.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> LOL. Trust me, he doesn't care if you resent something he does. It'll
>>> continue under the guise of friendship until you smarten up. ;p
>>
>> I knew that already, but I'll do things my way - thanks anyway. )
>
> I like the guy immensely, but I'm extremely wary of him.

Everyone should be wary of him. He uses people when he can, he lies and he
has no sense of what's right.

[~BD~]

FromTheRafters wrote:
> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
> news:yPednYdgGaVQpDPRnZ2dnUVZ8hidnZ2d@bt.com...
>> FromTheRafters wrote:
>>> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
>>> news:GbadnV3MTaCwljPRnZ2dnUVZ8oadnZ2d@bt.com...
>> [....]
>>
>>>> I was amazed to see that the names of Andrew Taylor and Peter Foldes
>>>> appeared in what is a site in a foreign language!
>>>
>>> Why does that surprise and amaze you?
>>
>> It's part of my nature I suppose!
>>
>>> While normally, using such a string for a search would yield results
>>> where that information was *only* in the headers or your google posts
>>> (that is, it would return all of your posts, and only your posts).
>>> Since
>>> you (or someone else, but probably you) has taken to posting the
>>> headers
>>> in the body, now that string appears in the bodies of all posts and
>>> followups to posts that didn't edit it out. You (or someone else, but
>>> probably you) have poisoned your own search results by posting your
>>> header information in the bodies of posts and crossposting.
>>
>> Ah! Maybe that explains much. I didn't know that Google searches only
>> the bodies of posts.
>
> That's not what I said, the thing is that fullquoted followup (reply)
> posts will propagate the bodies (and hence your search string) to posts
> which aren't yours. They wouldn't propagate it if it were only in the
> header (the references header provides the threading, so your MID does
> get propagated, but not your account # or posting host address etc...

I'm sorry if I've misunderstood.

>> However, I'm quite certain I must have posted *many* more than 3 or 4
>> headers (or parts of same) into message bodies over the years. My real
>> surprise was that so *few* results were found.
>
> Was that a Google Groups search? Or did you search the web?

I'm not meaning to be difficult when I say "can't you tell that from the
link I provided?"

I've just done a GG search and get just *one* hit (one that I am not at
all surprised by!) This is it:

http://groups.google.com/group/24hou...Y9OG9o84m_JMU6

You will note that, unlike the original link, this one starts with
"groups.google.com"

>> .... and those that /were/ found referred to AT and PF!
>
> Those had your header information (in the body) splattered on a webpage.
> Some, but not all, usenet posts get transplanted to the web.

I don't have much information about that. I *do* remember much fuss
being made on the Microsoft Communities sites about it being better not
to use the Web Interface facility and it being better to use Outlook
Express.

I had no idea at the time that this would mean making and receiving
posts to/from Usenet - a far more dangerous place (IMO).

>>> Do you remember an earlier discussion we had about this (regarding
>>> changing subject lines of posts and how it affects the ability to
>>> search)? Your actions have consequences, not from the 'powers that
>>> be' but just because of the way stuff works. Usenet articles now appear
>>> on the web thanks to gateways, in any language you like.
>>
>> Yes, I do remember. I try not to do it too often, but RonNNN made a
>> special request so that he can pick up items of possible interest.
>>
>>> Instead of clicking the link, try clicking the "Translate this page"
>>> link.
>>
>> It makes little difference here.
>>
>>> See that the content has nothing to do with the web user interface.
>>
>> I regret that I do not understand what you mean.
>
> The content is from Usenet, not the foreign language website. 'Translate
> this page' does not seem to affect that content.

I accept what you say, FTR.

Your help and advice *is* much appreciated. Thank you.

Dave

[~BD~]

FromTheRafters wrote:
> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
> news:yPednYdgGaVQpDPRnZ2dnUVZ8hidnZ2d@bt.com...
>
> If you want to add a crosspost, do it yourself - please do not attempt
> to make it look like *I* added it.
>
> I resent your use of "Followup-to:" to make me look like a troll.

Your comment concerns me.

Again, I do not understand what you are inferring. AFAICR, the only
times I've attempted to use "Follow-up" is when posting from Google
Groups (when my posting name is BoaterDave in full). I've not explored
how to do so in SeaMonkey - although I do sometimes add another
newsgroup in my address bar before I post.

When I did do so, RonNNN chastised me for my action, so I avoid using
the facility.

I had/have no wish or desire to make you look like a troll, FTR.

You will have to explain in more detail if you want me to recognise what
you are annoyed about. Regardless, I'm sorry if I have unwittingly upset
you.

[~BD~]

Dustin wrote:
> "FromTheRafters"<erratic@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in
> news:i8ln32$egq$1@news.eternal-september.org:
>
>> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
>> news:yPednYdgGaVQpDPRnZ2dnUVZ8hidnZ2d@bt.com...
>>
>> If you want to add a crosspost, do it yourself - please do not
>> attempt to make it look like *I* added it.
>>
>> I resent your use of "Followup-to:" to make me look like a troll.
>>
>>
>>
>
> LOL. Trust me, he doesn't care if you resent something he does. It'll
> continue under the guise of friendship until you smarten up. ;p

An example of *why* Jenn *doesn't* trust you!

I *do* care about FTR's concerns and feelings.

I recognise that he *could* be stringing me along and misleading me for
his own amusement - but I don't get those sorts of vibes about him.
We've been in contact for some years and I like his sense of humour
(which is not always at *my* expense! <g>)

FTR *may* have lied to me - but I am not aware of it.

OTOH, Peter Foldes lies all the time and the renowned MVP Robear Dyer
has lied too.

[FromTheRafters]

"~BD~" <~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
news:eZGdnUIuJ6XjIjPRnZ2dnUVZ8kadnZ2d@bt.com...
> FromTheRafters wrote:
>> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
>> news:yPednYdgGaVQpDPRnZ2dnUVZ8hidnZ2d@bt.com...
>>
>> If you want to add a crosspost, do it yourself - please do not
>> attempt
>> to make it look like *I* added it.
>>
>> I resent your use of "Followup-to:" to make me look like a troll.
>
> Your comment concerns me.
>
> Again, I do not understand what you are inferring.

I imply, you infer. )

> AFAICR, the only times I've attempted to use "Follow-up" is when
> posting from Google Groups (when my posting name is BoaterDave in
> full). I've not explored how to do so in SeaMonkey - although I do
> sometimes add another newsgroup in my address bar before I post.

It was, indeed, the BoaterDave nym.

> When I did do so, RonNNN chastised me for my action, so I avoid using
> the facility.

So, should I believe that you *accidently* added a.p.s. newsgroup?

What, your finger slipped? )

> I had/have no wish or desire to make you look like a troll, FTR.
>
> You will have to explain in more detail if you want me to recognise
> what you are annoyed about. Regardless, I'm sorry if I have
> unwittingly upset you.

If you look at the thread, and try to determine who initiated the
"unnecessary" crosspost to "alt.privacy.spyware" it will appear to the
uninitiated that it was *I* that did so. Those that understand how
Usenet works *can* investigate further to see the post I was responding
to had the line "Followup-To: alt.politics.scorched-earth,
alt.privacy.spyware" in the header.

If you want to act like a troll, that is your prerogative. To add the
crosspost in a manner that makes someone else look like a troll is also
your prerogative, but I would hope that you wouldn't want to discourage
*me* from continuing to engage you in conversation, as I have been
generally civil towards you despite the fact that people I trust, wish
that I would not respond to you at all, ever.

[~BD~]

FromTheRafters wrote:
> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
> news:eZGdnUIuJ6XjIjPRnZ2dnUVZ8kadnZ2d@bt.com...
>> FromTheRafters wrote:
>>> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
>>> news:yPednYdgGaVQpDPRnZ2dnUVZ8hidnZ2d@bt.com...
>>>
>>> If you want to add a crosspost, do it yourself - please do not
>>> attempt
>>> to make it look like *I* added it.
>>>
>>> I resent your use of "Followup-to:" to make me look like a troll.
>>
>> Your comment concerns me.
>>
>> Again, I do not understand what you are inferring.
>
> I imply, you infer. )

Oh Sh*t!

>> AFAICR, the only times I've attempted to use "Follow-up" is when
>> posting from Google Groups (when my posting name is BoaterDave in
>> full). I've not explored how to do so in SeaMonkey - although I do
>> sometimes add another newsgroup in my address bar before I post.
>
> It was, indeed, the BoaterDave nym.
>
>> When I did do so, RonNNN chastised me for my action, so I avoid using
>> the facility.
>
> So, should I believe that you *accidently* added a.p.s. newsgroup?
>
> What, your finger slipped? )

Hahaha! No, no accident. I *should have said *usually* avoid. You *must*
know by now that *everything* I do on-line is deliberate (but sometimes
I do not appreciate the consequences of my actions!)

I wanted Peter Foldes to explain himself in front of those folk who
would recognise that he was lying (without him noticing). It appears
that I was successful!

>> I had/have no wish or desire to make you look like a troll, FTR.

I'll say that again. I did *not* intend that you, FTR, should appear to
be a troll. When I reviewed the result in SeaMonkey, the post did appear
somewhat odd, but I didn't realise why. This is how it looked here:
http://i52.tinypic.com/iwhm2r.jpg

>> You will have to explain in more detail if you want me to recognise
>> what you are annoyed about. Regardless, I'm sorry if I have
>> unwittingly upset you.
>
> If you look at the thread, and try to determine who initiated the
> "unnecessary" crosspost to "alt.privacy.spyware" it will appear to the
> uninitiated that it was *I* that did so. Those that understand how
> Usenet works *can* investigate further to see the post I was responding
> to had the line "Followup-To: alt.politics.scorched-earth,
> alt.privacy.spyware" in the header.

I've got it!

From: BoaterDave <BoaterDave@hotmail.co.uk>
Newsgroups: alt.politics.scorched-earth
Subject: Re: What's so special about a single word?
Followup-To: alt.politics.scorched-earth, alt.privacy.spyware
Date: Wed, 29 Sep 2010 09:05:42 -0700 (PDT)
Organization: http://groups.google.com
Lines: 22
Message-ID:
<639f4899-1314-47ca-86b8-a7c55883f375@30g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>

> If you want to act like a troll, that is your prerogative. To add the
> crosspost in a manner that makes someone else look like a troll is also
> your prerogative, but I would hope that you wouldn't want to discourage
> *me* from continuing to engage you in conversation, as I have been
> generally civil towards you despite the fact that people I trust, wish
> that I would not respond to you at all, ever.

I apologise for doing something which appeared to put you at fault. I'm
sorry. It really wasn't intended to be that way.

You have been extremely helpful to me over the years and I do *not* want
to discourage you from engaging in conversation! I know you pull my leg
from time-to-time, but that's part of the fun of participating in
newsgroups!

[FromTheRafters]

"~BD~" <~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
news:Zq-dndhRzplmkjLRnZ2dnUVZ8qudnZ2d@bt.com...
> FromTheRafters wrote:
>> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
>> news:eZGdnUIuJ6XjIjPRnZ2dnUVZ8kadnZ2d@bt.com...
>>> FromTheRafters wrote:
>>>> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
>>>> news:yPednYdgGaVQpDPRnZ2dnUVZ8hidnZ2d@bt.com...
>>>>
>>>> If you want to add a crosspost, do it yourself - please do not
>>>> attempt
>>>> to make it look like *I* added it.
>>>>
>>>> I resent your use of "Followup-to:" to make me look like a troll.
>>>
>>> Your comment concerns me.
>>>
>>> Again, I do not understand what you are inferring.
>>
>> I imply, you infer. )
>
> Oh Sh*t!
>
>>> AFAICR, the only times I've attempted to use "Follow-up" is when
>>> posting from Google Groups (when my posting name is BoaterDave in
>>> full). I've not explored how to do so in SeaMonkey - although I do
>>> sometimes add another newsgroup in my address bar before I post.
>>
>> It was, indeed, the BoaterDave nym.
>>
>>> When I did do so, RonNNN chastised me for my action, so I avoid
>>> using
>>> the facility.
>>
>> So, should I believe that you *accidently* added a.p.s. newsgroup?
>>
>> What, your finger slipped? )
>
> Hahaha! No, no accident. I *should have said *usually* avoid. You
> *must* know by now that *everything* I do on-line is deliberate (but
> sometimes I do not appreciate the consequences of my actions!)
>
> I wanted Peter Foldes to explain himself in front of those folk who
> would recognise that he was lying (without him noticing). It appears
> that I was successful!
>
>>> I had/have no wish or desire to make you look like a troll, FTR.
>
> I'll say that again. I did *not* intend that you, FTR, should appear
> to be a troll. When I reviewed the result in SeaMonkey, the post did
> appear somewhat odd, but I didn't realise why. This is how it looked
> here: http://i52.tinypic.com/iwhm2r.jpg

Okay, so that might have misled you - once again, the benefit of the
doubt goes to you, but I realize that Peter may not have been expecting
*me* to add a crosspost, and that you were "using me" to perhaps trick
him.

Here, the followup-to is obvious:

http://hostphotofree.com/?bookmark=13789

....but my preview pane doesn't display that:

http://hostphotofree.com/?bookmark=13790

>>> You will have to explain in more detail if you want me to recognise
>>> what you are annoyed about. Regardless, I'm sorry if I have
>>> unwittingly upset you.
>>
>> If you look at the thread, and try to determine who initiated the
>> "unnecessary" crosspost to "alt.privacy.spyware" it will appear to
>> the
>> uninitiated that it was *I* that did so. Those that understand how
>> Usenet works *can* investigate further to see the post I was
>> responding
>> to had the line "Followup-To: alt.politics.scorched-earth,
>> alt.privacy.spyware" in the header.
>
> I've got it!
>
> From: BoaterDave <BoaterDave@hotmail.co.uk>
> Newsgroups: alt.politics.scorched-earth
> Subject: Re: What's so special about a single word?
> Followup-To: alt.politics.scorched-earth, alt.privacy.spyware
> Date: Wed, 29 Sep 2010 09:05:42 -0700 (PDT)
> Organization: http://groups.google.com
> Lines: 22
> Message-ID:
> <639f4899-1314-47ca-86b8-a7c55883f375@30g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>

Headers are one thing, but how a client interprets them and reacts to
them varies.

>> If you want to act like a troll, that is your prerogative. To add the
>> crosspost in a manner that makes someone else look like a troll is
>> also
>> your prerogative, but I would hope that you wouldn't want to
>> discourage
>> *me* from continuing to engage you in conversation, as I have been
>> generally civil towards you despite the fact that people I trust,
>> wish
>> that I would not respond to you at all, ever.
>
> I apologise for doing something which appeared to put you at fault.
> I'm sorry. It really wasn't intended to be that way.

I accept your apology, and want to note that I have nothing against the
good people in a.p.s. (even the ones with the shiny hats).

> You have been extremely helpful to me over the years and I do *not*
> want to discourage you from engaging in conversation! I know you pull
> my leg from time-to-time, but that's part of the fun of participating
> in newsgroups!

*Nobody* is safe from a little leg pulling. D

[~BD~]

FromTheRafters wrote:
> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
> news:Zq-dndhRzplmkjLRnZ2dnUVZ8qudnZ2d@bt.com...
[...]
>>> So, should I believe that you *accidently* added a.p.s. newsgroup?
>>>
>>> What, your finger slipped? )
>>
>> Hahaha! No, no accident. I *should have said *usually* avoid. You
>> *must* know by now that *everything* I do on-line is deliberate (but
>> sometimes I do not appreciate the consequences of my actions!)
>>
>> I wanted Peter Foldes to explain himself in front of those folk who
>> would recognise that he was lying (without him noticing). It appears
>> that I was successful!
>>
>>>> I had/have no wish or desire to make you look like a troll, FTR.
>>
>> I'll say that again. I did *not* intend that you, FTR, should appear
>> to be a troll. When I reviewed the result in SeaMonkey, the post did
>> appear somewhat odd, but I didn't realise why. This is how it looked
>> here: http://i52.tinypic.com/iwhm2r.jpg
>
> Okay, so that might have misled you - once again, the benefit of the
> doubt goes to you, but I realize that Peter may not have been expecting
> *me* to add a crosspost, and that you were "using me" to perhaps trick
> him.

No trick intended. 'Using you' had never crossed my mind.

> Here, the followup-to is obvious:
>
> http://hostphotofree.com/?bookmark=13789
>
> ...but my preview pane doesn't display that:
>
> http://hostphotofree.com/?bookmark=13790

I've got a problem here - they look like identical images to me.

>>>> You will have to explain in more detail if you want me to recognise
>>>> what you are annoyed about. Regardless, I'm sorry if I have
>>>> unwittingly upset you.
>>>
>>> If you look at the thread, and try to determine who initiated the
>>> "unnecessary" crosspost to "alt.privacy.spyware" it will appear to
>>> the
>>> uninitiated that it was *I* that did so. Those that understand how
>>> Usenet works *can* investigate further to see the post I was
>>> responding
>>> to had the line "Followup-To: alt.politics.scorched-earth,
>>> alt.privacy.spyware" in the header.
>>
>> I've got it!
>>
>> From: BoaterDave<BoaterDave@hotmail.co.uk>
>> Newsgroups: alt.politics.scorched-earth
>> Subject: Re: What's so special about a single word?
>> Followup-To: alt.politics.scorched-earth, alt.privacy.spyware
>> Date: Wed, 29 Sep 2010 09:05:42 -0700 (PDT)
>> Organization: http://groups.google.com
>> Lines: 22
>> Message-ID:
>> <639f4899-1314-47ca-86b8-a7c55883f375@30g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>
>
> Headers are one thing, but how a client interprets them and reacts to
> them varies.

I once thought they told the truth. I now know that they can be easily
manipulated by those who wish to do so. I didn't know anything about
headers until 5 years ago!

>>> If you want to act like a troll, that is your prerogative. To add the
>>> crosspost in a manner that makes someone else look like a troll is
>>> also
>>> your prerogative, but I would hope that you wouldn't want to
>>> discourage
>>> *me* from continuing to engage you in conversation, as I have been
>>> generally civil towards you despite the fact that people I trust,
>>> wish
>>> that I would not respond to you at all, ever.
>>
>> I apologise for doing something which appeared to put you at fault.
>> I'm sorry. It really wasn't intended to be that way.
>
> I accept your apology,

Thank you. It is sincere.

> and want to note that I have nothing against the
> good people in a.p.s. (even the ones with the shiny hats).
>
>> You have been extremely helpful to me over the years and I do *not*
>> want to discourage you from engaging in conversation! I know you pull
>> my leg from time-to-time, but that's part of the fun of participating
>> in newsgroups!
>
> *Nobody* is safe from a little leg pulling. D

Of course not! Apart from the very serious undertone of scorched-earth,
90% of posts should be about fun and entertainment. In 'aps' I hope that
the technical guys can keep me on a reasonable path!

[FromTheRafters]

"~BD~" <~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
news:AcSdnZHWiNfOsjLRnZ2dnUVZ7s6dnZ2d@bt.com...
> FromTheRafters wrote:

[...]

>> Okay, so that might have misled you - once again, the benefit of the
>> doubt goes to you, but I realize that Peter may not have been
>> expecting
>> *me* to add a crosspost, and that you were "using me" to perhaps
>> trick
>> him.
>
> No trick intended. 'Using you' had never crossed my mind.
>
>> Here, the followup-to is obvious:
>>
>> http://hostphotofree.com/?bookmark=13789
>>
>> ...but my preview pane doesn't display that:
>>
>> http://hostphotofree.com/?bookmark=13790
>
> I've got a problem here - they look like identical images to me.

For some reason, the second image I uploaded, replaced the first (same
name was used).

This should have been the first:

http://hostphotofree.com/?bookmark=13795

....that is, if it works this time; hostphotofree.com has its quirks, it
wouldn;t accept my PNG file even though it says it should, and now has
my second upload replace my first apparently because of the non-unique
name.

[...]

[~BD~]

FromTheRafters wrote:
> "~BD~"<~BD~@nomail.afraid.org> wrote in message
> news:AcSdnZHWiNfOsjLRnZ2dnUVZ7s6dnZ2d@bt.com...
>> FromTheRafters wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>>> Okay, so that might have misled you - once again, the benefit of the
>>> doubt goes to you, but I realize that Peter may not have been
>>> expecting
>>> *me* to add a crosspost, and that you were "using me" to perhaps
>>> trick
>>> him.
>>
>> No trick intended. 'Using you' had never crossed my mind.
>>
>>> Here, the followup-to is obvious:
>>>
>>> http://hostphotofree.com/?bookmark=13789
>>>
>>> ...but my preview pane doesn't display that:
>>>
>>> http://hostphotofree.com/?bookmark=13790
>>
>> I've got a problem here - they look like identical images to me.
>
> For some reason, the second image I uploaded, replaced the first (same
> name was used).
>
> This should have been the first:
>
> http://hostphotofree.com/?bookmark=13795
>
> ...that is, if it works this time; hostphotofree.com has its quirks, it
> wouldn;t accept my PNG file even though it says it should, and now has
> my second upload replace my first apparently because of the non-unique
> name.
>
> [...]
>
>

Do you see what you intended me to see now? At first sight all images
look the same here.